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Post Info TOPIC: Is recognizing diversity goals lowering standards in the Fire Service?
James Pearson; Columbus, Ohio

Date: Tue Dec 13 12:29:10 2011
RE: Is recognizing diversity goals lowering standards in the Fire Service?
  
 


There is a need for more scholarship as we dicuss the issue of fire service diversity.  Research organizations and universities have done a lot of research on this and related issues.  The subject can not be limited to diversity on the fire department.  To do that is to limit the scope of the discussion and defeat the purpose of fully exploring the historical, sociological, political and economic issues that are too often left unaddressed.

 

I wrote a history of thr Columbus, Ohio fire department that includes a proposal for gearter diversity.  I am willing to share it with IABPFF members.  Send me your name and chapter address and I will send you a copy.

 

James Pearson



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Chief DMD

Date: Mon Mar 28 19:18:25 2011
  
 

Greetings all; just weighing in on the issue of diversity and standards.  

First, let me say - let's not get caught up in the hype - when there is constant reference to "lowering the standards" in most instances it refers to women and people of color as they gain entry into any fire department organization.

Let's be clear - there is only "one" standard that determines if "any" firefighter is "qualified" to do this job - NFPA 1001: Standard for Fire Fighter Professional Qualifications.  

All fire service organizations or associated training entities should be teaching to this standard and nothing else.  This standard is recognized by both The National Board on Fire Service Professional Qualifications (Pro Board) and The International Fire Service Accreditation Congress (IFSAC).

Any discussion on lowering standards is just rhetoric designed to distract those that have no insight into this industry / profession.  Let's never fail to recognize the fact that these are trainable skills that require practice, commitment, and dedication to our craft.

The dialogue on lowering skills are separate conversations, and WE should not entertain that conversation and validate this absurdity under any circumstance.

All that I am I owe....I live eternally in the red. 




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Tinney

Date: Fri Dec 17 09:33:30 2010
  
 

ie: The new Assistant Chief never took a promotional exam. union president>private> asst.Chief. go figure! lowering standards is the enemies smoke screen. dont believe the hype.no

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Ron Mackey

Date: Tue Nov 9 10:05:56 2010
  
 

I have question on merit and standards, what are the standards for fire departments in America when the officer incharge of their company is off duty because of injury, vacation, sick leave, etc., who replaces that officer? "ACTING," most fire department use "Acting officers," who are those actors? They are those who have never taken a promotional exam or who have fail the exam or they never got promoted BUT they are RESPONSIBLE for the crew and the citizens of their city, well where is the MERIT?



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Lifetime Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 258
Date: Mon Nov 8 09:28:02 2010
  
 

Brother Stephenson,

Is "diversity" in the UK any more of a problem than in the US?  I think the membership would be interested to know about the societal differences; and how blacks manage.

Les


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Les Outerbridge


President - MOCHA Society, Buffalo, NY Chapter

Status: Offline
Posts: 19
Date: Tue Nov 2 09:47:53 2010
  
 

Hotep All,
     Thank you for all of your very insightful comments. My own contribution centers on the standards and the standard setters being all too often incapable of seeing the world from a diverse perspective. If the ruling in the NYC vs the Vulcan's case indicated anything, it's the fact that the process includes too many steps where the voices of the totally unqualified are allowed to skew the result without checks to the advantage of the white males. The ruling in the Ricci case is another such example. The Supremes in that ruling failed to develop even the basic understanding of the process of validity, testing based upon actual experience, and the political context in decision making. The absence of effective standards renders the question of lowered or raised moot, weather one approaches the question from a goal of diversity or the trickier desegregation. As Les points out here, the goal of all efforts as it regards the nations Fire Service has and will remain the same, all white all male all the time and everywhere. That is unfortunately the standard to be achieved..... 

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Corresponding Secretary - UK Chapter

Status: Offline
Posts: 2
Date: Mon Nov 1 13:20:33 2010
  
 

Hi Darren,

Well said! 

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D.M.Stephenson


Lifetime Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 258
Date: Sat Oct 30 23:23:48 2010
  
 

Diversity suggests that the “process” will begin with discussion  based on the viewpoint that everyone began / begins at the same starting point.  What has been eliminated from the equation is two basic facts;  black males are graduating from high school at rates below forty percent and hundreds of years of domination by Irish Catholic males, who are (all of a sudden) forced to share employment that they've always seen as their entitlement. 

 

It is also important to bear in mind that this discussion has been initiated by a white majority who (in a changing world) are fast becoming the minority! This race has never been run fairly and my obstacle has to do with respondents signing on to choruses of Kum Ba Ya as the solution!   Maybe someone can put me back on track . . . 



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Les Outerbridge


ITC Chair/Corresponding Secretary - Austin, TX Chapter

Status: Offline
Posts: 776
Date: Thu Oct 28 12:43:31 2010
  
 

Well stated responses in which I totally agree with.

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41646_762366504_4554_q.jpg Fraternally, Darren Hyson



Lifetime Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 3
Date: Thu Oct 28 10:33:28 2010
  
 

Brother Hyson, I don't really tie hiring goals and diversity initiatives in the same bundle. I see hiring goals as an equal employment opportunity position for the organization while, diversity initiatives reflect the organization's committment to developing recognition, understanding and appreciation of cultural differences among its employees and the community.

That recognition should maximize the organization's ability to respond to the unique needs within a given community and allow the employee to perform the duties of his/her job at full potential due to their ability to identify and connect with that community's needs, fears, expectations etc. 

I believe that performance can be enhanced by the inclusion of people who reflect those cultural differences and, a by-product of that inclusion is the creation of a workforce of top performers, who produce quality service for the organization and deliver quality care for the customer.

We,  have to speak the loudest about OUR our ability to meet ANY standard for the job, given the employment opportunity.

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Samuel P. Crawford
MJB

Date: Tue Oct 19 11:15:36 2010
  
 

NO! The standards are not lowered as long as everyone meets the minimum requirements. I believe it is up to us individually as firefighters to promote the fire service. If a young man or woman is not around professional firefighters growing up, they are not likely to consider the fire service as a career.

Kids see athletes, school teachers, and police officers on television. Rarely do you see firefighters. Minority recruiting is not a priority for most cities. We can not complain about diversity when we have the ability everyday to speak to our sons, daughters, nephews and neighbors, and youths at church.


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valerie amado

Date: Tue Oct 19 09:59:27 2010
  
 

i believe diversity broadens the talent that is available without comprimising services

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Anonymous

Date: Tue Oct 19 09:05:56 2010
  
 

I respectfully bring to your attention an error in the opening sentence of your message/question.  The following sentence has a typo that slipped passed the reviewer:  "Diversity should not be used as an excuse to higher folks that can’t do the job...".  The correct word and spelling should be hire.  I am certain that you agree that this is a small oversight that could have larger ramifications.

Respectfully,

Tom Echols
Rocket City F.I.R.E.
Huntsville (AL) Fire & Rescue


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ITC Chair/Corresponding Secretary - Austin, TX Chapter

Status: Offline
Posts: 776
Date: Mon Feb 22 21:04:07 2010
  
 

Diversity should not be used as an excuse to hire folks that can’t do the job; there are too many minorities that can. Diversity should not be used to lower standards and all too often many folks try to associate diversity with lowered standards. It is wrong for any department to lower standards to obtain diversity and it is equally wrong for us to associate diversity with lowered standards. Let’s recognize, define, embrace, and promote diversity in our department and the Fire Service because it follows best practices for any organization which serves a diverse community, and while doing so keeps our career a respected one.

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41646_762366504_4554_q.jpg Fraternally, Darren Hyson

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